Posts by paul from cleveland

128

The upside of atheism

by paul from cleveland in

i realize whether you believe in god or the non-existence of god it has to be taken on faith since both positions are unknowable and unprovable.

however, i can understand faith in god as basically a hope for something better.

i can also understand agnosticism; admitting it's unknowable but still leaving the door open (perhaps the only intellectually honest option).

paul from cleveland

Many atheists don't believe in god in much the same way you don't believe in ghosts or the tooth fairy or santa claus. Do you think it is intellectually honest to say that since I cannot prove that santa doesn't exist I should say I don't know? The complete lack of any evidence for a fairy tale is considered sufficient to dismiss it, why not the fairy tale of theism too?

That's just a "straw man" argument. I mean Einstein was a theist (along the lines of Spinoza's ideas) so it's not a totally irrational position to me.

I think most Atheists would certainly be open to the possiblity of such a being if evidence were to emmerge.

That seems like a reasonable position.

128

The upside of atheism

by paul from cleveland in

i realize whether you believe in god or the non-existence of god it has to be taken on faith since both positions are unknowable and unprovable.

however, i can understand faith in god as basically a hope for something better.

i can also understand agnosticism; admitting it's unknowable but still leaving the door open (perhaps the only intellectually honest option).

paul from cleveland

my belief is that there is 'probably no god'

It's impossible to prove for certain, without any doubt

So far, no one who has posted has claimed to be a Gnostic atheist so that really makes us all some form of Agnostics. (according to HintofLimes chart on the first page of this thread)

People that believe that there is no God, or that believe that God is wicked and destructive and therefore should not be obeyed, tend to act without regard for God. Without God, they answer only to society and themselves. When they answer to themselves and society instead of a "higher cause", they tend to make better (and usually quicker) decisions. And, if they make a bad decision, they can reverse it more quickly without having to appeal to some Almighty God that is only going to confuse them even worse.

This comment relates to peoples actions. I'm not wondering about that. I'm wondering why it's not more appealing to just admit "I don't know" and leave the door cracked just a little bit. (since we're all some form of Agnostic anyway) Some form of hope for the possibility of something better rather than the belief that all that awaits us is old age, death, and the grave. Gone forever.

128

The upside of atheism

by paul from cleveland in

i realize whether you believe in god or the non-existence of god it has to be taken on faith since both positions are unknowable and unprovable.

however, i can understand faith in god as basically a hope for something better.

i can also understand agnosticism; admitting it's unknowable but still leaving the door open (perhaps the only intellectually honest option).

paul from cleveland

Do you believe that all of them *might* exist, or do you believe that 9,999 of them do not exist but one of them - the one your parents taught you about - *might* exist?

Besty, I just think there is probably "something" rather than "nothing" but I can't prove anything. We're both not 100% sure so we both believe in some form of Agnosticism.

128

The upside of atheism

by paul from cleveland in

i realize whether you believe in god or the non-existence of god it has to be taken on faith since both positions are unknowable and unprovable.

however, i can understand faith in god as basically a hope for something better.

i can also understand agnosticism; admitting it's unknowable but still leaving the door open (perhaps the only intellectually honest option).

paul from cleveland

Do you believe that all of them *might* exist, or do you believe that 9,999 of them do not exist but one of them - the one your parents taught you about - *might* exist?

I don't know. I'm an Agnostic Theist. I can't prove I'm right.

128

The upside of atheism

by paul from cleveland in

i realize whether you believe in god or the non-existence of god it has to be taken on faith since both positions are unknowable and unprovable.

however, i can understand faith in god as basically a hope for something better.

i can also understand agnosticism; admitting it's unknowable but still leaving the door open (perhaps the only intellectually honest option).

paul from cleveland

I guess it was Gnosticism that I didn't understand after all.

128

The upside of atheism

by paul from cleveland in

i realize whether you believe in god or the non-existence of god it has to be taken on faith since both positions are unknowable and unprovable.

however, i can understand faith in god as basically a hope for something better.

i can also understand agnosticism; admitting it's unknowable but still leaving the door open (perhaps the only intellectually honest option).

paul from cleveland

there probably is no god (like I'm 99.99999% sure, but don't want to be too dogmatic)

So you're an Agnostic Atheist. I can understand that position.

128

The upside of atheism

by paul from cleveland in

i realize whether you believe in god or the non-existence of god it has to be taken on faith since both positions are unknowable and unprovable.

however, i can understand faith in god as basically a hope for something better.

i can also understand agnosticism; admitting it's unknowable but still leaving the door open (perhaps the only intellectually honest option).

paul from cleveland

Ahh but I don't think we can choose beliefs. Either you believe or you don't. If you are choosing, then it's not actually belief.

Thanks beksbks, I agree with that.

Thanks again HintofLime. Your chart had a definition of my position. I had never heard of those distinctions before.

128

The upside of atheism

by paul from cleveland in

i realize whether you believe in god or the non-existence of god it has to be taken on faith since both positions are unknowable and unprovable.

however, i can understand faith in god as basically a hope for something better.

i can also understand agnosticism; admitting it's unknowable but still leaving the door open (perhaps the only intellectually honest option).

paul from cleveland

I know what I am now. I'm an Agnostic Theist.

128

The upside of atheism

by paul from cleveland in

i realize whether you believe in god or the non-existence of god it has to be taken on faith since both positions are unknowable and unprovable.

however, i can understand faith in god as basically a hope for something better.

i can also understand agnosticism; admitting it's unknowable but still leaving the door open (perhaps the only intellectually honest option).

paul from cleveland

I'm just wondering if anyone is really a "Gnostic athiest"? Anyone here?

128

The upside of atheism

by paul from cleveland in

i realize whether you believe in god or the non-existence of god it has to be taken on faith since both positions are unknowable and unprovable.

however, i can understand faith in god as basically a hope for something better.

i can also understand agnosticism; admitting it's unknowable but still leaving the door open (perhaps the only intellectually honest option).

paul from cleveland

Thanks pixiesticks and frankiespeakin